On Will Power
Question:
Will power over something requires greater motivation than the temptation. If the motivation is missing, one has to resort to major distraction. I do better in the major distraction department. EX: My main eating time is between the time I get off work and the time I go to bed. I try to get out of the house, go visit people, get involved in a hobby or book at home, start painting a wall, whatever. Henrietta
Response:
Will power over something requires greater motivation than the temptation. If the motivation is missing, one has to resort to major distraction. I do better in the major distraction department.
In order for you to use distraction, you must first invoke your will power to resist the temptation. Otherwise, you would never get to the distraction in the first place.
Response:
In order for you to use distraction, you must first invoke your will power to resist the temptation. Otherwise, you would never get to the distraction in the first place.
The distraction is to avoid the temptaion in the first place. Henrietta
Response:
Ada Ma (Snipped) I give you a living chicken to you and ask you to kill it. It’ll possibly take you at least half an hour to figure out how to kill it.
If it takes you 1/2 hour to figure out more than one way to kill a chicken, you have more serious problems. Henrietta
Response:
:: ::: In order for you to use distraction, you must first invoke your will ::: power to resist the temptation. ::: ::: Otherwise, you would never get to the distraction in the first ::: place. :: :: :: The distraction is to avoid the temptaion in the first place. :: Henrietta Right, and it took the choice to invoke will power to take the distraction. If you chose your distraction well, then less will power is needed. For example — say you don’t like exercise. In order to use exercise as a distraction during your evening home time when you might overfeed, it will take a lot more will power to go ride a stationary than it would to go visit your best friend. My theory (just from personal experience, mind you) is that one must practice using will power. It is not a simple thing in general. If you make the choice that you will exercise because it improves your health, then it will become necessary to exercise rather than go visit that good friend. Okay, you made the choice for improved health, but what gets you the rest of the way: IMO, will power. Many people who don’t develop application of will power end up not being able to really live the choices they want to make. This is all my opinion, of course, and certainly isn’t any better than anyone elses. However, this is the way I think about it. One should do what works for them.
Response:
Now..I know this sounds extreme…comparing dieting to murder….but in some ways..its right….if only I could have the same conviction for not overindulging or to continue exercising…as I have not to do bodily harm to others….I mean…its so easy NOT to kill someone…I mean, I can’t even IMAGINE something so horrible…yet…where is that same "force" to keep me from eating an entire pizza?
IMO, you don’t need will power, you need won’t power — as in, I won’t eat this donut just because somebody brought a box to the office, and it’s free. While I don’t, in general subscribe to the 12-step formulae (expanded from AA to various other support systems), I think one of the most positive ideas to be gleaned from them is that they focus on today. You can’t do anything about what you ate yesterday, and tomorrow isn’t here yet. Focus on "I won’t eat crap today," and "I’ll do my exercise routine today," and don’t worry about how you’re going to continue it for the next week, month or year. As to portion control – it will not likely ever come if the whole pizza, or whole package of any other food is sitting in front of you, and you just expect yourself to stop eating it before it’s gone. You have to dole out a portion, and put the rest away before you start eating. Make it a conscious decision and conscious effort to get up and get more, rather than unconsciously hand-to-mouthing it until it’s gone. This gives you the opportunity to think about whether you’re really still hungry, or just want more out of habit, or something to do with your hands as you’re watching TV. Some people chronically overeat while not paying attention to what they’re eating — eating while watching TV, reading, driving, working, walking around the house. Several authors suggest that you never eating standing up, and sit yourself down at a table without such distractions and consciously enjoy your food when you eat. Some people need to slow down, pausing during the meal, to take the time to actually enjoy the food, and to feel if they’re getting satisfied or getting full, instead of just eating until they suddenly realize they’re stuffed. HTH — "There’s a seeker born every minute."
Response:
:: The distraction is to avoid the temptaion in the first place. :: Henrietta Right, and it took the choice to invoke will power to take the distraction. If you chose your distraction well, then less will power is needed.
This makes no sense. The time sequence is as follows. 1) Tempted 2) Will Power Required To Initially Stop The Temptation 2) Action Taken – eat, distract or other. For example — say you don’t like exercise. In order to use exercise as a distraction during your evening home time when you might overfeed, it will take a lot more will power to go ride a stationary than it would to go visit your best friend.
Not the same thing. Two distractions, one chosen. Exercise may or may not be a more difficult choice. My theory (just from personal experience, mind you) is that one must practice using will power.
Everyone only gets better at invoking will power through practice. Okay, you made the choice for improved health, but what gets you the rest of the way: IMO, will power.
Yep, at some point will power is at the root of all decisions. It is, as they say, ground zero in the decision making profile. Many people who don’t develop application of will power end up not being able to really live the choices they want to make.
I’d say all, not many. This is all my opinion, of course, and certainly isn’t any better than anyone elses.
Why do you provide this disclaimer? If it is worth asserting, it should be worth backing up aggressively. As in "My opinion is valid, I believe it to be right, otherwise I would shut the hell up."
Response:
I wish that I could recall where I saw this….I’m thinking it was Dr. Phil, in the days of only Oprah…but it may have been a different daytime talk show about dieting….but the message it was trying to convey has stayed with me… The idea was…about sticking to diets or exercise etc….that some people just don’t have the "will" power ….. but it pointed out, that we all make conscience decisions not to do many things…that we all have will
power….we I’ve read a lot of interesting responses to this and I just had to jump in here. I guess first I wonder what happens to the person who doesn’t have the "will power" to stick to a diet or exercise? Do they simply not have any will power? I don’t think it is as simple as that. Someone mentioned choices, and made an interesting point that if we had no will power there would be no opportunity for choices, and I think that is very true. All of htis is very interesting me also because I work as an addictions counselor at a prison. I deal with drug addicts and alcoholics but through my work I’ve found many similar behaviors in my own life when it comes to food. Now I’m not saying that people who can’t stay on a diet or whatever are addicted to food, but for me I think I can safely say that. Think about this though, when someone begins using alcohol or drugs there is a period of time there that his/her body is not physically addicted to the substance, after a period of time the body builds up tolerance and needs more and more for the same effect and leads to person to become dependent upon this substance. However, some people may never become addicted. (*Side note, I would argue that dependent upon the substance anyone who tried would become addicted, but others may not be the case*) Now think about food for a second, we are born physically dependent upon food. We have to have it to live, no questions asked, we didnt’ have a choice to say I’m going to eat for or not eat food, like an addict did before that first hit. In my opinion food, is one of the biggest and probably the worst addictions there is. Now do I see people at the prison I work there because they robbed a store because they were "addicted to food". No, but I think a lot of people who have a problem with their weight might realize that their thoughts, behaviors, their whole life is "out of whack" and could be addicted to food, which is causing problems. I could be way off here, but this discussion brought up a lot of these issues in my mind that I"ve talked with my wife before about and with many of my clients. What do you think?? B-Worthey
Response:
Now..I know this sounds extreme…comparing dieting to murder….but in some ways..its right….if only I could have the same conviction for not overindulging or to continue exercising…as I have not to do bodily harm to others….I mean…its so easy NOT to kill someone…I mean, I can’t even IMAGINE something so horrible…yet…where is that same "force" to keep me from eating an entire pizza? and thus..doing harm to myself etc??? Is it in the fear of reprocussion? Cause I’m living with the 70 lbs of reprocussion… Any thoughts? I know this is a little crazy….its one of those days…
You could think of overeating and carrying around 70 lbs of excess fat as killing yourself. And why should feel any different about killing yourself than about killing someone else? If you can’t bring yourself to kill someone, stop killing yourself. martin — Draft Wesley Clark for President! www.DraftWesleyClark.com
Response:
What does "reprocussion" mean in English?
It means repercussion. In English, repercussion means a remote or indirect consequence of some action. You should develop the ability to think outside the box. It would have strong reprocussions for you. I suppose thinking outside the box isn’t part of the curriculum in west texas. Curriculum means a course of academic studies. You better stay in the box. And close the lid while your at it. martin — Draft Wesley Clark for President! www.DraftWesleyClark.com
Response:
Wow…lots of great points and ideas here….I was curious where and how the group would stand on a discussion of will power… sometimes…when I’m driving past the Taco Bell where they hold my beloved Chalupas….I think about stopping…but my will power and desire to stay with this WOE is strong (not having cravings certainly help) … but before going LC .. I would tell myself…No Chalupas today…but then would find myself at the drive-thru…..no will power….and I longed to have the strong resolve to stick with a diet…the kind of resolve that keeps me on the straight and narrow in regards to SO many other things…..I believe..in time, that I will be able to automatically self police regarding food choices as I do with other enjoyable, but deniable behaviors. Thanks all for posting! Kira
Response:
<snip The idea was…about sticking to diets or exercise etc….that some people just don’t have the "will" power ….. but it pointed out, that we all make conscience decisions not to do many things…that we all have will power….we can all control our actions…at all times……the example they used, oddly enough…was murder…that we all exhibit the will power not to murder someone….or commit a crime etc .. and that this same will power, can be channeled into controlling our own behaviour…whether its food or drink….etc…
<snip This will power idea sounds so medieval. Like Dawn Taylor said above, we should make choices and not force ourselves to do things that we dislike through will power. IMHO the concept of Will Power is desolete in terms of dieting. You need will power to stay alive if you’re being throw into a POW camp, given hardly any food and have to chew vermins for protein. [Movie: Empire of the Sun] You need will power to survive if you’re the single survivor of a ship wreck, floating around in a raft on the sea for months and food is running out. [Book: The Life of Pi] Talking using will power to stop yourself taking that pack of cream cakes off the supermarket shelf? That’s overkill. I mean…its so easy NOT to kill someone…
Yes, that’s because killing someone is quite hard work!!! And how many of us NEED to kill someone (or any living beings) on a daily basis? Imagine that you’ve never killed a chicken before in your entire life, and now I give you a living chicken to you and ask you to kill it. It’ll possibly take you at least half an hour to figure out how to kill it. To turn the argument around, I think most people in here would need Will Power to get them to kill someone.
Response:
I guess first I wonder what happens to the person who doesn’t have the "will power" to stick to a diet or exercise? Do they simply not have any will power? I don’t think it is as simple as that. Someone mentioned choices, and made an interesting point that if we had no will power there would be no opportunity for choices, and I think that is very true.
Thank you. Think about this though, when someone begins using alcohol or drugs there is a period of time there that his/her body is not physically addicted to the substance… Now think about food for a second, we are born physically dependent upon food. We have to have it to live, no questions asked, we didnt’ have a choice to say I’m going to eat for or not eat food, like an addict did before that first hit. In my opinion food, is one of the biggest and probably the worst addictions there is.
First, we would have to agree on a definition for addiction. "compulsive need for and use of a habit-forming substance (as heroin, nicotine, or alcohol) characterized by tolerance and by well-defined physiological symptoms upon withdrawal; broadly : persistent compulsive use of a substance known by the user to be harmful." Is food habit forming in the same sense as nicotine, heroin or alcohol? Not really. There are no well defined symptoms from reduced food intake and food, by its nature, is not harmful. Food is harmful only in overindulgence (forget about allergies, insulin spikers, etc). I conclude food is not addictive. Now do I see people at the prison I work there because they robbed a store because they were "addicted to food". No, but I think a lot of people who have a problem with their weight might realize that their thoughts, behaviors, their whole life is "out of whack" and could be addicted to food, which is causing problems.
No doubt about that; obesity has many components. I could be way off here, but this discussion brought up a lot of these issues in my mind that I"ve talked with my wife before about and with many of my clients. What do you think??
See above.
Response:
:: Wow…lots of great points and ideas here….I was curious where and :: how the group would stand on a discussion of will power… :: :: sometimes…when I’m driving past the Taco Bell where they hold my :: beloved Chalupas….I think about stopping…but my will power and :: desire to stay with this WOE is strong (not having cravings :: certainly help) … but before going LC .. I would tell myself…No :: Chalupas today…but then would find myself at the drive-thru…..no :: will power….and I longed to have the strong resolve to stick with :: a diet…the kind of resolve that keeps me on the straight and :: narrow in regards to SO many other things…..I believe..in time, :: that I will be able to automatically self police regarding food :: choices as I do with other enjoyable, but deniable behaviors. :: :: Thanks all for posting! :: :: Kira Kira — make the *choice* to practice exercising *will power.* You’re doing this because you want to make better *choices* concerning your health. Learning to exercise *will power* is a *choice*. You need more than *will power* alone, for if you don’t make the right *choices,* *will power* will do nothing for you. 
Bottom line: keep working at it. keep your focus. babysteps, the kidsteps, growpersonsteps. you improve with time and practice.
Response:
This will power idea sounds so medieval.
Basic truths are simplistic. Like Dawn Taylor said above, we should make choices and not force ourselves to do things that we dislike through will power.
That makes no sense. Talking using will power to stop yourself taking that pack of cream cakes off the supermarket shelf? That’s overkill.
That’s reality. Yes, that’s because killing someone is quite hard work!!!
Not at all. And how many of us NEED to kill someone (or any living beings) on a daily basis? Imagine that you’ve never killed a chicken before in your entire life, and now I give you a living chicken to you and ask you to kill it. It’ll possibly take you at least half an hour to figure out how to kill it.
lol 30 minutes to figure out how to snap a neck or crush a head with a rock?
Response:
I wish that I could recall where I saw this….I’m thinking it was Dr. Phil, in the days of only Oprah…but it may have been a different daytime talk show about dieting….but the message it was trying to convey has stayed with me… The idea was…about sticking to diets or exercise etc….that some people just don’t have the "will" power ….. but it pointed out, that we all make conscience decisions not to do many things…that we all have will power….we can all control our actions…at all times……the example they used, oddly enough…was murder…that we all exhibit the will power not to murder someone….or commit a crime etc .. and that this same will power, can be channeled into controlling our own behaviour…whether its food or drink….etc… Now..I know this sounds extreme…comparing dieting to murder….but in some ways..its right….if only I could have the same conviction for not overindulging or to continue exercising…as I have not to do bodily harm to others….I mean…its so easy NOT to kill someone…I mean, I can’t even IMAGINE something so horrible…yet…where is that same "force" to keep me from eating an entire pizza? and thus..doing harm to myself etc??? Is it in the fear of reprocussion? Cause I’m living with the 70 lbs of reprocussion… Any thoughts? I know this is a little crazy….its one of those days… Kira 225/215/140 LC since 8-6-03
Response:
Unless you are a nut-case, you don’t enjoy murdering someone, but you do enjoy eating to overindulgence or not exerciseing (ie, doing something else). So, you overeat because you get something from it (you have incentive) whereas you can find a zillion things you’d rather do than exercise. To overcome this, try this trick (I’m making this up on the fly). Identify a food you don’t like — for me it was broccoli. Force yourself to eat some everyday, for least one meal. Now, why do this? Well, that food being good for you is one reason, another would be practicing gaining control over your actions. increase the amount. Then add another food. Then, work in the other direction. Pick a food you love and start NOT eating that food. Work up over time. After I while, you will find that you have control — you just need to learn how to exert it. I’ve got to go.
:: I wish that I could recall where I saw this….I’m thinking it was :: Dr. Phil, in the days of only Oprah…but it may have been a :: different daytime talk show about dieting….but the message it was :: trying to convey has stayed with me… :: :: The idea was…about sticking to diets or exercise etc….that some :: people just don’t have the "will" power ….. but it pointed out, :: that we all make conscience decisions not to do many things…that :: we all have will power….we can all control our actions…at all :: times……the example they used, oddly enough…was murder…that :: we all exhibit the will power not to murder someone….or commit a :: crime etc .. and that this same will power, can be channeled into :: controlling our own behaviour…whether its food or drink….etc… :: :: Now..I know this sounds extreme…comparing dieting to murder….but :: in some ways..its right….if only I could have the same conviction :: for not overindulging or to continue exercising…as I have not to :: do bodily harm to others….I mean…its so easy NOT to kill :: someone…I mean, I can’t even IMAGINE something so :: horrible…yet…where is that same "force" to keep me from eating :: an entire pizza? and thus..doing harm to myself etc??? Is it in :: the fear of reprocussion? Cause I’m living with the 70 lbs of :: reprocussion… :: :: Any thoughts? I know this is a little crazy….its one of those :: days… :: :: Kira :: 225/215/140 :: LC since 8-6-03
Response:
Sounds sound… So…the will power to overcome something can be developed….this seems to be a good strategy…I hate broccoli too… and your right….perhaps if we make it something less drastic…like..speeding…I love to drive fast..i……but I don’t…because I know I could hurt someone or myself…or get a ticket…so I easily don’t do that which I enjoy….why is it easy to control speeding and not eating?? (just playing devils advocate..because I believe that there is something to the idea of will power being more "auto pilot" then struggle….) perhaps following your suggestion, things would become more auto-pilot…although, hard to imagine liking broccoli.. Thanks for responding! Kira
Response:
People generally don’t need to restrain themselves from murder because they don’t want to do it in the first place. The argument is completely specious. Martin
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I wish that I could recall where I saw this….I’m thinking it was Dr. Phil, in the days of only Oprah…but it may have been a different daytime talk show about dieting….but the message it was trying to convey has stayed with me… The idea was…about sticking to diets or exercise etc….that some people just don’t have the "will" power ….. but it pointed out, that we all make conscience decisions not to do many things…that we all have will power….we can all control our actions…at all times……the example they used, oddly enough…was murder…that we all exhibit the will power not to murder someone….or commit a crime etc .. and that this same will power, can be channeled into controlling our own behaviour…whether its food or drink….etc… Now..I know this sounds extreme…comparing dieting to murder….but in some ways..its right….if only I could have the same conviction for not overindulging or to continue exercising…as I have not to do bodily harm to others….I mean…its so easy NOT to kill someone…I mean, I can’t even IMAGINE something so horrible…yet…where is that same "force" to keep me from eating an entire pizza? and thus..doing harm to myself etc??? Is it in the fear of reprocussion? Cause I’m living with the 70 lbs of reprocussion… Any thoughts? I know this is a little crazy….its one of those days… Kira 225/215/140 LC since 8-6-03
Response:
First, looking for knowledge on Oprah is an oxymoron.
No it’s not. Everything on Oprah is without wisdom? Do you even watch the shows? The self is an illusion generated by the brain to organize the multiple chaotic, independent processes that are constantly going on. See, for example, "Consciousness Explained" by Daniel Dennett or "The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind" by Julian Janes.
And you ask me why I think you have no faith?
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in front of God and everybody: Now..I know this sounds extreme…comparing dieting to murder….but in some ways..its right….if only I could have the same conviction for not overindulging or to continue exercising…as I have not to do bodily harm to others….I mean…its so easy NOT to kill someone…I mean, I can’t even IMAGINE something so horrible…yet…where is that same "force" to keep me from eating an entire pizza? and thus..doing harm to myself etc??? Is it in the fear of reprocussion? Cause I’m living with the 70 lbs of reprocussion… Any thoughts? I know this is a little crazy….its one of those days…
I think that if you stop yourself from doing something — eating "bad" foods, murder, adultery, vandalism — by relying on "will power" you’re setting yourself up for failure. The concept of will power implies that you’re bracing yourself to hold fast against something that’s almost overwhelmingly tempting, and that the only thing stopping you from taking the leap is sheer, teeth-gritted, white-knuckle determination. Seen that way, it’s no wonder that "will power" fails so often. Personally, I think it’s more constructive to think of things in terms of making choices. Almost nothing in life is so persuasively seductive that it can’t be denied simply by making healthy choices. I haven’t lost 40 pounds through will power — I’ve lost it through choosing to eat better and exercise more. There’s a big difference. If I spent every day in a battle of wills against chocolate cookies, I’d have never made it this far. And I’d be exhausted. You have to *want* to do the right thing. If it takes will power to keep from cheating on your spouse or to not eat a slab of banana-cream pie, then you need to reassess what your priorities are. Yes, there are things that are tempting in life, things that could be momentarily pleasurable but damaging in the long term. Knowing what the end result would be should make it less tempting — and definitely makes your choice easier. That’s what I think, anyway. Dawn — REVIEW: "Once Upon a Time in Mexico" http://www.portlandtribune.com/archview.cgi?id=20229 DAILY DOSE OF HUMDRUM: http://www.livejournal.com/users/dtaylor
Response:
I think that if you stop yourself from doing something — eating "bad" foods, murder, adultery, vandalism — by relying on "will power" you’re setting yourself up for failure.
Maybe for you. Will power works dandy for many folks….who have reached a certain level of control in their lives. The concept of will power implies that you’re bracing yourself to hold fast against something that’s almost overwhelmingly tempting,
What? Overwhelmingly tempting? Not at all. Something can be slightly tempting, temporarily tempting, permanently tempting, occasionally tempting, et al. and that the only thing stopping you from taking the leap is sheer, teeth-gritted, white-knuckle determination. Seen that way, it’s no wonder that "will power" fails so often.
Seeing your overstated and overblown definitions, no wonder you have no success with will power. Personally, I think it’s more constructive to think of things in terms of making choices.
No will power, no chance for choice. Almost nothing in life is so persuasively seductive that it can’t be denied simply by making healthy choices.
Contradictory within contradiction. Reread your post above. I haven’t lost 40 pounds through will power — I’ve lost it through choosing to eat better and exercise more. There’s a big difference. If I spent every day in a battle of wills against chocolate cookies, I’d have never made it this far. And I’d be exhausted.
Completely senseless. You have to *want* to do the right thing. If it takes will power to keep from cheating on your spouse or to not eat a slab of banana-cream pie, then you need to reassess what your priorities are.
Why can’t someone be tempted and resist it? Christ did. Many here on ASDLC do everyday and report their success. Yes, there are things that are tempting in life, things that could be momentarily pleasurable but damaging in the long term. Knowing what the end result would be should make it less tempting — and definitely makes your choice easier.
And without will power, you simply do and face the consequences. That’s what I think, anyway.
pffffft.
Response:
What does "reprocussion" mean in English? — JC "1. eat less you fat fuck 2. exercise more you fat fuck" …Lyle
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I wish that I could recall where I saw this….I’m thinking it was Dr. Phil, in the days of only Oprah…but it may have been a different daytime talk show about dieting….but the message it was trying to convey has stayed with me… The idea was…about sticking to diets or exercise etc….that some people just don’t have the "will" power ….. but it pointed out, that we all make conscience decisions not to do many things…that we all have will power….we can all control our actions…at all times……the example they used, oddly enough…was murder…that we all exhibit the will power not to murder someone….or commit a crime etc .. and that this same will power, can be channeled into controlling our own behaviour…whether its food or drink….etc… Now..I know this sounds extreme…comparing dieting to murder….but in some ways..its right….if only I could have the same conviction for not overindulging or to continue exercising…as I have not to do bodily harm to others….I mean…its so easy NOT to kill someone…I mean, I can’t even IMAGINE something so horrible…yet…where is that same "force" to keep me from eating an entire pizza? and thus..doing harm to myself etc??? Is it in the fear of reprocussion? Cause I’m living with the 70 lbs of reprocussion… Any thoughts? I know this is a little crazy….its one of those days… Kira 225/215/140 LC since 8-6-03
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I think <will power is a good thing. So many people in this group for so long are looking to lose, but still try to find chocolate ice cream subsitutes. If your health is the key <and obesity leads to you know what then stay low carb. Fight the urges. Exercise. Sometimes, alot of time, you just have to say <no. No matter how low carb you stay, you will still get urges to binge. If you must, do it at your discretion, not your insulins. Rich R.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I wish that I could recall where I saw this….I’m thinking it was Dr. Phil, in the days of only Oprah…but it may have been a different daytime talk show about dieting….but the message it was trying to convey has stayed with me… The idea was…about sticking to diets or exercise etc….that some people just don’t have the "will" power ….. but it pointed out, that we all make conscience decisions not to do many things…that we all have will power….we can all control our actions…at all times……the example they used, oddly enough…was murder…that we all exhibit the will power not to murder someone….or commit a crime etc .. and that this same will power, can be channeled into controlling our own behaviour…whether its food or drink….etc… Now..I know this sounds extreme…comparing dieting to murder….but in some ways..its right….if only I could have the same conviction for not overindulging or to continue exercising…as I have not to do bodily harm to others….I mean…its so easy NOT to kill someone…I mean, I can’t even IMAGINE something so horrible…yet…where is that same "force" to keep me from eating an entire pizza? and thus..doing harm to myself etc??? Is it in the fear of reprocussion? Cause I’m living with the 70 lbs of reprocussion… Any thoughts? I know this is a little crazy….its one of those days… Kira 225/215/140 LC since 8-6-03
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Now see I completely disagree here. Don’t try and tell me that we have not all, for the most part, been so pissed off or insensed even once in our lives that the thought of happily murdering someone has not crossed our minds. Brother/sister? spouse? parent? friend/lover who has dissapointed us? Don’t tell me the thought has never passed through our minds. We do exert ‘won’t’ power over these impulses. Some of us even get to the point where we dream or plan the event but still hold back on the actual killing for real. People generally DO restrain themselves from a step to far. It just may not be as concious a thing for many as it is for others. "Martin" People generally don’t need to restrain themselves from murder because they don’t want to do it in the first place. The argument is completely
specious.
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I have started taking .5mg xanax 3 to 4 times daily, with Wellbutrin 150X 2X daily, what a hugh difference. I am just hoping to find something like klonopin so that I am not popping pills every 4 to 5 hours of the day. 
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